With membership at new lows and no electoral wins to their name, it’s time for the Greens to ditch the malignant narcissist who’s presided over its decline.

"How has Stein fared as a leader? By AOC’s perfectly reasonable standard, she’s done abysmally. As of July 2024, a mere 143 officeholders in the United States are affiliated with the Green Party. None of them are in statewide or federal offices. In fact, no Green Party candidate has ever won federal office. And Stein’s reign has been a period of indisputable decline, during which time the party’s membership—which peaked in 2004 at 319,000 registered members—has fallen to 234,000 today.

This meager coalition can’t possibly kick-start a legitimate political movement, capable of organizing voters and advancing ideas outside of perennial electoral events. It’s just large enough, however, to spoil the work of those who put in this kind of work."

  • LustyArgonian@lemmy.worldEnglish
    01·
    2 months ago

    A gun is not the same as a vote. Your analogy is not a good one and doesn’t work because voting is a unique right.

    I don’t want your vote to count alongside mine

    This is fascism. This is where we disagree. I am not the thought police for others. I am simply my own advocate and that’s it. Others can agree or not.

    there is a baseline level of education that should be a requirement to vote. This is illegal and unconstitutional. You called it a requirement so you are indeed stopping the uneducated from voting if they don’t meet that requirement.

    I’m saying we should put more focus into education. We are substantially more educated now than 100 years ago, and people were allowed to vote then. I’m much smarter than the average white male farmer back then.

    We are talking about voting 3rd party. And how 3rd party “spoils” elections. You yourself literally said 3rd party would be a valid choice in an ideal voting situation. So if Dems want more votes, they shouldn’t come out with 3rd party hit pieces. 3rd parties are only an issue because of the way we structure voting - we agree here.

    No, it doesn’t. That’s the lazy answer. That’s the defeatist answer. ‘Lazy’ is an ableist term. I have a thumb injury that makes it hard to type. I also already typed an extremely long reply to you and that topic was tangential imo. I have a very good policy proposal for education that I could dig up in my old comments- basically a national online school that anyone can enroll in for credit. So if adults want to take 5th grade science, they can. No time limits. Greater language and disability access. Can be supplemental to brick and mortar education. Will prevent gaps in education due to school shooters, sickness, travel, or poverty.

    I agree that education needs reform and that we have a misinformation issue.

    That is what I’m saying. I’m not trying to take away anyone’s rights. I’m not trying to tell anyone what to do

    I’m with you there - say THOSE things then. Advocate foe policy that increases education. Do not say stuff like “basic education should be a requirement for voting,” because that’s indeed saying you want to take away rights and tell people what to do.

    • chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world
      1·
      2 months ago

      This is fascism.

      Anything can be fascism when taken completely out of meaning. Maybe if you completed the quote you’d have a little bit of context for the argument. I’m done with this discussion, it seems you are more than willing to twist my words to give artistic license to what you want me to say than to actually read what I wrote. Take it easy, stranger. Hope you are able to make thoughts and prayers work out for a better world, because that seems to be all you are capable of.

      • LustyArgonian@lemmy.worldEnglish
        01·
        2 months ago

        Okay, I hope this discussion has left you with at least some thoughts of your own regarding how you speak about voting. In today’s climate where our civil rights are being eroded, it matters what people say and how they say it. No one wants to parrot old disenfranchisement dog whistles from ya know, the times when they denied black people the right to vote because they lacked an education white people found valid. And saying “basic education should be a requirement to vote,” is LITERALLY a dog whistle from then. That’s like saying gay people should wear a pink triangle and then acting confused when I take issue with that specific verbiage and idea. Please consider how propaganda affects all of us and we all may pick up problematic speech from time to time because we live in a dystopia. People who engage in problematic rhetoric also deserve a basic education in things like civil rights and hate speech right? Otherwise it’s dangerous.

        seems to be all you are capable of.

        Lol, such a random stray out of no where. Also ableism agaiiiiin why

        I really miss ~2016 Late Stage Capitalism on Reddit and I was hoping Lemmy would have some of those same people. I miss them.

        • chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world
          1·
          2 months ago

          Okay, I hope this discussion has left you with at least some thoughts of your own regarding how you speak about voting.

          The same thoughts I came in with, that education is needed now more than ever.

          In today’s climate where our civil rights are being eroded, it matters what people say and how they say it.

          Which makes me wonder how you can be so smarmy with every sentence that you type. Your people skills leave much to be desired.

          . No one wants to parrot old disenfranchisement dog whistles from ya know, the times when they denied black people the right to vote because they lacked an education.

          Ahh, we’re back to twisting my words. I’ll repeat them, so we can ensure that the context lives on: “I’m not saying that we should take away the right to vote from the uneducated. I’m saying we should put more focus into education.”

          You know, for posterity, since your brand of journalism leans into the yellow end of the spectrum.

          And saying “basic education should be a requirement to vote,” is LITERALLY a dog whistle from then.

          It certainly is. Good thing I didn’t say it. I said that we should make sure that we are educating people along with their rights. Giving people rights and hoping they know what to do with them is how we ended up with Trump in office.

          That’s like saying gay people should wear a pink triangle and then acting confused when I take issue with that specific verbiage and idea.

          Oh, let me see which logical fallacy this falls into. I’m thinking either Red Herring or Equivocation.

          Please consider how propaganda affects all of us and we all may pick up problematic speech from time to time because we live in a dystopia.

          You seem to be the one drawing false equivocation and shielding yourself behind an unrelated argument because you know that you have no ground to stand on. But, please, tell me how I’m anti-LGBTQ+, again. I’m sure the second time you say it, it will come true.

          People who engage in problematic rhetoric also deserve a basic education in things like civil rights and hate speech right? Otherwise it’s dangerous.

          Well, at least you seem to have a grasp on the lesson I am trying to teach you.

          Lol, such a random stray out of no where. Also ableism agaiiiiin why

          Is this red herring, again? I can’t be sure, but I think you either don’t understand what I said, or you don’t understand ableism. Either way, that ain’t me, chief.

          I really miss ~2016 Late Stage Capitalism on Reddit and I was hoping Lemmy would have some of those same people. I miss them.

          No one is stopping you from making a triumphant return to the cesspool you crawled out of. You can ride a donkey in while they fan you with palm fronds.

          So, there now. I’ve responded to every insipid argument you’ve made, and nothing you’ve said can be taken out of context. You are not the person you seem to think you are. You manipulate and twist words to serve your own ends, and people like you are the reason we have a lot of the issues we do. I’m gonna go ahead and block you now, so feel free to have the last word, I won’t try to stop you.

          • pooperNickel@lemm.ee
            2·
            2 months ago

            I just read this whole argument and you are correct. This person seems to think talking about third parties honestly might hurt people’s feelings and that somehow takes their rights away. Ri-fuckin-diculous

          • LustyArgonian@lemmy.worldEnglish
            02·
            2 months ago

            Which makes me wonder how you can be so smarmy with every sentence that you type. Your people skills leave much to be desired.

            No self awareness on your projection here? Lol

            You also said:

            there is a baseline level of education that should be a requirement to vote.

            I don’t want your vote to count alongside mine

            Giving people rights and hoping they know what to do with them is how we ended up with Trump in office.

            So you DO want to tell people who to vote for?

            Ps Red Herring is a literary device. You mean strawman, I think.

            Pss you may want to rethink your use of chief and yellow

            Reddit and LSC was taken over by rightwingers, this is known. Can’t go back bc everyone was banned for being leftwing. Literally, it was a scandal on a different small reddit that also got banned. Ironically, I was permabanned for advocating that people go vote. This was not a bannable position in 2016, when 60% of the sub was pro-Bernie.

            Since you’re blocking me anyway, I’m not going to take a lot of time with your comment. I will say that you misunderstood the example of a dogwhistle I was using regarding pink triangle - which I used because I thought you wouldn’t be anti-queer and would notice it.

            A good judge for ableism, I’d if you’re saying something a Nazi would also say to justify gassing a prisoner. So lazy - yup. Incompetent -yup. Just has to be reactionary regarding someones abilities and hostile - hostility is an invitation to violence.

            I’ve responded to every insipid argument you’ve made, and nothing you’ve said can be taken out of context. You are not the person you seem to think you are. You manipulate and twist words to serve your own ends, and people like you are the reason we have a lot of the issues we do. I’m gonna go ahead and block you now, so feel free to have the last word, I won’t try to stop you.

            Here, try reading this again, the irony is really too funny:

            Your people skills leave much to be desired.

            Lol

            Okay, block me, that was always allowed.

      • LustyArgonian@lemmy.worldEnglish
        01·
        2 months ago

        Here’s my other comment about what I think should be done for education. I have spoken with educators around the country about this idea and they tend to really like it, so long as they are paid for the work they do and they don’t have more students to oversee directly.

        https://lemmy.world/comment/12277181

        I would like to not be hostile with you, although I can appreciate that I upset you. I would really be grateful if you would read about my educational idea above, because it’s something we are both very passionate about and if you like it too, it’s something you may enjoy talking to others about.