Zionists? It was zionists who colonized. They did so with the intention of creating a Jewish state.

Decolonization would be… decolonization. Return Palestinian land to the Palestinians. There are still plenty of people alive from the first Nakba. They all deserve their land back. A dissolution of the Israeli state and the creation of a new state of Palestine. Which would necessitate a total dismantling and withdrawal of the entirety of the Israeli state. An international criminal Court to prosecute all crimes against humanity that have ever been committed by the Israeli state. Redistribution of wealth from the Israeli state. How to handle things from there should be up to the new state of Palestine. They have a right to self-determination. Through mediation, but still it should be up to them. It was their land. They have the right to decide what happens with it.

I’d say at the very least the Zionists should go. The entire Israeli state is not composed of zionists. But the entirety of anyone who has ever served in the IDF or the Israeli government should at the least be sent back to the countries they or their fathers came from. Anyone who has participated in the ethnic cleansing of Palestine. Anyone who has murdered Palestinians. They don’t have a right to be there. But, like I said that’s just what I would think is just. It shouldn’t be up to western white people to decide. Palestinians deserve the right to choose what happens with their homes.

I would say the same thing about America or Canada, to be clear. That decolonizing them would be to return land to the Natives and allow them to form their own states and determine what happens with their land. It’s a more complex question of what they should do from there, but it was always their land and they deserve the power to say what happens with it.

And, to be clear, I’m not saying I believe this is what will happen. Merely what I’m saying ought to happen. What actual justice would look like.

Again, Jewish people are not synonymous with Israelis. Those 1.5% Jewish people were not the zionist colonizers. They had existed there prior to Israel. Israel was created by colonizers who espoused the ideology of zionism, that the Jewish religion had a right to it’s own state and that it had the right to take land away from other people to make that state. This ideology is still in practice today. They are slowly committing ethnic cleansing to expand their state. They believe they have a right to significantly more than just Gaza or the West Bank. Which they never had the right to begin with. They displaced millions of people from their homes that had been there for centuries. Millenia in some cases. It is colonization.

Was manifest destiny wrong? Was it wrong for the American settlers to displace native Americans, to steal their land and ethnically cleanse them? Then it is absolutely unequivocally necessarily wrong for the Israelis to do the same to Palestinians.

And so just because there existed discrimination against Jewish people that justifies stealing the land of Palestinian to give them their own state? Why wasn’t one founded anywhere else? Why not colonize somewhere in the middle of Europe? Why not somewhere with sparse population? Why is it fine for them to take Palestinian land and homes and drive them out?

Jewish people are not the same as Israelis. Most Israelis are Jewish, but there are many jewish people who are not Israelis and who are anti-zionist. Colonialism isn’t fine because the colonizers were facing discrimination. That doesn’t justify them committing atrocities and stealing the land of others.

Jewish people have always existed in region, yes. You’ll note that Israel has not always existed in the region. Being Jewish is not synonymous with being an Israeli. The millions of settlers who came to the area to create a Jewish state on Palestinian land were definitionally colonizers. They literally went somewhere that they did not live, somewhere no one in their family had lived, and drove out the people who were already living there. They literally stole homes and stole land from Palestinians living there.

The zionist project began long before WW2. It was not given to them. Palestinians never agreed to giving away their home. The Europeans just did not care if they colonized Palestine or not.

There are lots of dissenting Israelis… but the overwhelming majority of the country is in favor of genocide. The country was founded by colonizing settlers. They went there to steal land and drive out the native peoples living there. Stands to reason colonial racism is a very prominent and popular idea in public opinion.

Yeah I was just gonna say he’s saying this now? As though the settlers just popped up yesterday, as though this hasn’t been a problem since the colonization began.

Israel is committing acts of genocide today against Palestinians. Israel is a settler colonial nation in the same style as 17th/18th century Canada and America. They have always been actively committing atrocities by forcefully relocating and mass murdering the native population of the region, Palestinians.

You are engaging in genocide denialism. Literally denaying the way men women and children are being mass murdered. Israel isnt a country that came to exist out if the diaspora who were living there. It came to exist as a result of mass migration and colonization. From the very beginning Israel has been committing acts of mass violence. Moving a bunch of people into a region to change the demographics of that region and mass displace the people presently living there is genocide. Destroying a culture is genocide. Bombing school, hospitals, is genocide. Shooting children is genocide. Forced mass starvation is genocide. Depriving children of water is genocide.

Look at maps of the Gaza strip. See the amount of it that Israel has declared evacuations on. If there is an evacuation declared for a particular area Israel has free reign in those areas to commit whatever acts of mass violence they choose. The victims must all be hamas, since the evacuation order is there. They will soon declare all but the southern tip evacuated. Settlers are already in the strip. Israel is pushing for one final ejection of Palestinians. One last effort to take their homes forever.

Fuck Benjamin Netanyahu. Fuck the Likud Party. Fuck the IDF. Fuck Israel. And fuck genocide deniers like you, literal conspiracy theorists about genocides being faked. You’re imperialist fascist scum.

Why? Because they both happened in China?

The delivery driver was in desperation because they were going to lose money by being held up by the security guard. They weren’t protesting or demonstrating, just trying to do their job and literally could not afford to wait around. Probably because they are paid a pittance and are paid by the delivery instead of by hour worked. This is also a problem in North America and Europe. Delivery drivers are classified as independent contractors to avoid being given hourly wages and benefits. This incident was a symptom of poor regulation of the delivery industry.

I’m not sure how any of that relates to tank man aside from the fact that both incidents took place somewhere in China. I’m not saying critiquing the Chinese government isn’t worthwhile, but it comes off entirely fangless when you just throw out tank man in a completely unrelated situation. If our goal is better rights and living conditions for workers in China (and everywhere else), the least we can do is actually argue for those things. Criticizing the Chinese state for censoring information on the Tiannamen Square Protests has its place. Doing so here just detracts from the actual subject of the post.

Idk what makes you believe that. These images are and have always been available online. Similar albeit less graphic images appear frequently on news sites all around the world. People don’t support genocide because they aren’t aware of how brutal it is, they support it because they do not view the victims of genocide as human.

That’s a fair and valid criticism of the way western media is censoring the ongoing genocide. I do think there is some merit in reminding people of the brutality that is being enacted on men women and children. I don’t agree that showcasing these kinds of images in this way is the way to go about it. Images of graphic violence can be exploitative, they can be voyeuristic and serve actually to dehumanize victims rather than humanize them. I think photos of survivors with wounds, people being taken to hospital, and the ruins of the area left behind are important and should be spread far and wide.

I do not think that photos of mangled bodies are worthwhile though. I do not feel that images of horrifically torn apart and disfigured remains serve any function beyond satiating a curiosity some have. I feel the same way about photos and videos taken after mass shootings or other large-scale acts of horrific violence. It’s important that people understand what took place, but it doesn’t have to be conveyed in this manner.

Maybe I’m being pointlessly moralistic about this, and should feel that so long as it brings attention to what is happening that it is a good thing that I should support. But I don’t agree with that at all. I do think it’s relevant how we spread information about ongoing genocides and their victims.

I’ve watched videos of it in the past that were posted online. I just disagree that showcasing horrific gore and violence in this manner is necessary. It is necessary for people to understand what’s happening, if they don’t. But in the aftermath of mass shootings and other forms of large scale graphic violence I don’t think it’s necessary to showcase images of dead and mangled bodies. It’s a kind of voyeurism I personally find distasteful and disrespectful to those that died. Pictures of survivors with wounds, hospitals full of patients. Rubble and ruins. Those things are worthwhile in my mind. But not mangled corpses.

I do not think this photo is necessary to be viewed. We know what the aftermath of these attacks look like. The victims and their families deserve peace, not to be made a spectacle.

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Again, I can see the possible intent behind this. And I agree that it was most likely not done with the intention of coming across as anti Semitic. But that is how others see it. Read the news articles about it. Look at the comments people have left.

And blood on their hands? Them being what? Jewish people? Are you saying that all Jewish people bear responsibility for the crimes of the state of Israel?

But she was Jewish. She was a Jewish victim of a genocide of jewish people. It is a very prominent opinion that those advocating for Palestinian liberation are promoting a genocide of jewish people.

Re read the first paragraph of the comment you’re responding to. I’m not interested in continuing this conversation if you are entirely incapable of considering how this will be viewed and how this impacts people without our own movement.

Did you miss the part where i said that I understood the intent but am calling out how this makes our movement look like fucking neo nazis? Do you want to re read what I’ve said please before throwing more baseless accusations at me?

No I wouldn’t give a shit if they painted pro Palestine messages on any non-holocaust related memorials. Because that wouldn’t make us look like neo nazis. This does. People are going to talk about this on the news today and millions of people will shake their head and lend more credence to claims that we are antisemites. And Jewish anti zionists now know that due to their religion some anti zionists are entirely willing to throw them under a bus in the name of “rattling cages”.

They did and they were wrong but his walks also did not bolster claims of anti semitism by defacing memorials to holocaust victims

To be clear, totally down with civil unrest. This is not civil unrest. This is defacing a statue of a universally known holocaust victim. A victim who was a helpless child.

Rattling the cage of “innocent victims of genocide” is literally the last fucking cage anyone should ever rattle like what are you talking about. This is the shit that neo nazis do. This action puts us in league with neonazis in the mind of the majority of the public like what do you mean?? Also how is defacing genocide victim statues doing anything to further our cause of international recognition of the genocide of Palestinian?

Break some windows. Civil unrest, fight back against the states that support this genocide. No question yea do that. Don’t deface Anne Franke statues like I genuinely can’t even believe this has to be said. Again, how do you think this makes jewish anti-zionists feel? Does this make them feel welcome in our movement?